| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
470
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Posted - 2014.08.06 16:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Yes BUT give them short timer (10-20 minutes) after which the K162 side spawns anyway, regardless of being jumped through or even had a warp initiated to. Otherwise we will end up with massive amounts of unspawned holes. It would also fix already existing issue with people leaving their holes unspawned when farming.
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
473
|
Posted - 2014.08.13 13:55:00 -
[2] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hey everyone. Like I mentioned earlier in the thread we completely agree with the concerns raised here about this change potentially decreasing the number of exits to K-space dramatically. We've done a bit more investigating and chatting with the CSM and we are currently planning to give K162s a random chance to appear every once and a while whenever they have less than 15 hours of lifespan remaining. Under this system, the K162 spawning mechanics would be as follows: - K162 wormholes and signatures are spawned in an invisible state when someone initiated warp to the other side of the connection.
- K162 signatures become immediately visible when someone jumps through the wormhole connection for the first time.
- IF the K162 signature is in an invisible state and the wormhole connection has less than 15 hours of lifetime remaining, it will have a chance of becoming visible every few minutes, balanced so that virtually all K162s will appear within a couple hours or less from this point.
This will ensure that if people choose not to warp through their wormhole connections after warping to them, the wormhole systems on the other side will still gain the ability to use that connection eventually. This does not address the issue of people isolating themselves by not even warping to their fresh static at all.
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
473
|
Posted - 2014.08.13 14:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
In fact this makes matters even worse. Now you can simply farm your heart out without anyone being able to come up your static chain. The timer for spawning both sides of a WH that has not even been warped to should be max 20 minutes. Having 7+ hours of perfect safety and total isolation from the rest of New Eden is just ridiculous.
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
473
|
Posted - 2014.08.13 14:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Axloth Okiah wrote:This does not address the issue of people isolating themselves by not even warping to their fresh static at all.
If you don't warp to a wormhole at all, it will act in the same way that it does now. However since players will now get a less extreme early warning when a new connection that exits in their system appears and we're adding more random wormhole connections, this should help a little bit with the isolation problem. Why not fix the "isolation problem" right away and simply spawn both sides of every hole after a short timer? This change and multi-hour timers lean very heavily towards making isolating oneself even more effective. It is more than enough time to farm all your home sites and you, instead of fixing the problem of people shutting themselves off, introduce additional timer on top of that to provide even longer window of total safety.
Whats the reasoning behind 7+ hours? How is that going to help promote conflict and interaction between players if anyone can simply choose to not have a wormhole spawn for so many hours? Unless you intend to increase the amount of random connections more than 10-fold, this will lead to shorter and more barren chains full of invisible and unspawned connections.
The slightly shorter early warning will not offset that either, as that problem lies in the overlay itself, not the K162 spawning mechanics. If you want to fix the early warning problem, simply introduce a short timer (tens of minutes, not hours) during which freshly spawned WH sigs will not show up on the overlay and need to be manually scanned. After the timer is over, they will autopopulate as they do now. This will give gankers their time window to kill farmers who dont pay attention, without ruining the convenience of Odyssey changes.
But thats a different issue. It seems to me you have a perfect opportunity to elegantly fix the isolation issue, but instead you are trying to fix a different problem using a wrong tool for the job, while making the isolation even worse as a side-effect.
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
475
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 10:18:00 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Even with the timer, K162s will never appear unless someone has initiated warp to the other side.
If you don't warp to a wormhole at all, the behavior of that wormhole will not be changing in Hyperion. Which is very very very bad design serving no useful purpose whatsoever and we are begging you to fix it.
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
476
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 10:55:00 -
[6] - Quote
epicurus ataraxia wrote:things Thats a massive stretch. We have absolutely no idea on numbers or how common any of those new holes will be. We dont know whether you will be getting new incoming connections every 20 minutes and 1/3 of them will be the new low-mass holes, or whether it will remain business as usual when you just close your static and remain cut off for hours. Yet you are already conjuring prophecies of unrelenting killzones without any ability to farm ever... based on what?
Also suggesting "keep unspawned K162s, we have new connections to counteract it" is the same argument as "you dont need to wear seatbelts, we added airbags". First of all, 50% of those new connections will be "outgoing", so they might not even get spawned at all if ppl dont warp to them. Even if they do, maybe ppl wont feel like jumping through, so thats another 9+ hours extra time to remain isolated. Remember you will be able to decide whether you want the new hole or not even after you check out where it leads to, thanks the ridiculously long timer.
At any rate, this design failure can be fixed extremely quickly and easily, with no detriment to anyone except people who want to remain isolated from the rest of the game. So why not just fix it now instead of living with that crap for many more years for no good reason?
W-Space Realtor |
Axloth Okiah
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
476
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 12:08:00 -
[7] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:Axloth Okiah wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Even with the timer, K162s will never appear unless someone has initiated warp to the other side.
If you don't warp to a wormhole at all, the behavior of that wormhole will not be changing in Hyperion. Which is very very very bad design serving no useful purpose whatsoever and we are begging you to fix it. While i do agree Ax that it is indeed bad design and my preferred option would be that the K162 does spawn regardless of an initiated warp after a fixed time period. I just think it would then cause them to just get in the habit of critting holes so no net end benefit. IMHO critted/bubbled/picketed connections are still much better than no connections at all. You can still jump a carrier full of T3s through a crit hole, or you can seed ships, insert scouts, gather intel, etc. If someone wants to prevent others from interfering it should require some effort, resources and manpower, and not just the "ability" to not warp to the hole or in the new iteration to not jump through the hole.
So please let people crit the holes, as it requires at last some activity and carries some risk. But both sides should be interactable.
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